BREAKING NEWS:Harley Davidson closing a plant due to declining sales.

[Mike Rocket]

Cam tensioners started out with spring tensioners. Then the aftermarket folks introduced gear driven. Which is Ok but the run out on the pinions ate the gears. Harley came out with the hydraulic system which works rather well but still requires a check at or around 40,000 miles. Inner pad wears first for some reason. The primary automatic tensioner on the Twin cam has been a problem since day one. Way to tight. Primary chain tension ends up eating the bearings. I believe Harley quit using the automatic tensioner on the newer modals but did not leave a window in the primary case to make adjustments on manual tensioners. This results in removal of primary case to make adjustments to primary chain tensioners. Unlike the older models that had a window for such adjustments. 103 models had a real problem with there stators. Harley up graded the stators quickly due to the fact that they were going out while the bikes were still under warranty and was costing them money. The motor compensater was a left over from the 88 cubic inch and worked well on the 96 cubic inch but when they went to the 103 it did not. Later model 103 cubic inch acquired the Screaming eagle compensater but just by design was not getting the proper oil coverage. Harley redesigned and still had problems. Baker an aftermarket company that deals with Motor compenstater and primary tensioners for Harley's makes some quality products that work. Very expensive but American made. Don't get me wrong. Not bashing Harley's but do know the weak points of the twin cam. I work on them a lot. Every new engine design from Harley has resulted in problems. Starting to get folks showing up wanting work done on there Milwaukee eights. So we are still in a learning curb but it has become very apparent that this motor is no exception. It has it's problems. Knowing what I know I tell them sorry take her to the dealership. If I were in the market for a new Harley I would wait a year or two and let the company work the bugs out. I'm sure that once Harley has the chance to figure it out and make the Necessary changes the Milwaukee eight will be a engine that shines.

Thanks for the information

 

[sonny]

YOUR WELCOME

 

[Casey G Hoyt]

Nothing really new there.

Look - the answer is simple. And it's not just HD. Despite our obvious bias on here - Big cruisers are NOT selling well.
I am taken by the fact that almost all my mates here are downsizing.
And most were not riding HUGE bikes to start with. I don't know why but there it is.

I can't remember when I last saw a "wing" out and about. More and more it's "adventure" and "cafe-racer". HD had these in the form of Buell and killed them off.

The difference is that other marques have recognised it and aimed elsewhere HD seems (here anyway) very unwilling to do so.

And what always amuses me is that the press thinks we care. Nobody got so worried when Triumph nearly died, or Guzzi.
Actually I think a lot of bikers back then thought - That'll teach them to listen".
It's purely a "Made in USA" knee jerk. Make what we (the grand collective) need or die.
If Honda decided next week that they would make no more large bikes - would the world bleat? - Would Honda worry?

As of 2020 - I think large bike sales in Europe WILL slump. Most commuter type bikes will soon have to be electric (or hybrid) to be viable.

Edited - I do think sometimes - "OK, if the R3 is dead - what would I buy?". And the answer is pretty much always - "I don't know". But pretty strong likelihood it would be sub 1000cc. More sporty.

Apparently the R3 is undergoing a revamp. 2020 we will probability see a 2500 cc "muscle bike" with no touring option. Just a big bad ass torque machine.

 

[Bondysbike]

Apparently the Baby-Boomers all have motorcycles, Generation X is only buying a few, and the next generation isn't buying any at all. A recent study was done to find out why. Here are the reasons why Millennials don't ride motorcycles:

1. Pants won't pull up far enough for them to straddle the seat.
2. Can't get their phone to their ear with a helmet on.
3. Can't use 2 hands to eat while driving.
4. They don't get a trophy and a recognition plaque just for buying one.
5. Don't have enough muscle to hold the bike up when stopped.
6. Might have a bug hit them in the face and then they would need emergency care.
7. Motorcycles don't have air conditioning.
8. They can't afford one because they spent 12 years in college trying to get educated in gender studies .
9. They are allergic to fresh air.
10. Their pajamas get caught on the exhaust pipes.
11. They might get their hands dirty checking the oil.
12. The handle bars have buttons and levers and cannot be controlled by touch-screen.
13. You have to shift manually and use something called a clutch.
14. It's too hard to take selfies while riding.
15. They don't come with training wheels like their bicycles did.
16. Motorcycles don't have power steering or power brakes.
17. Their nose ring interferes with the face shield.
18. They would have to use leg muscle to back up.
19. When they stop, a light breeze might blow exhaust in their face.
20. They would need to upgrade before the in-transit expired.
21. It could rain on them and expose them to non-soft water.
22. It might scare their therapy dog, and then the dog would need therapy.

Crickeeee...these are all the reasons I bought one?

 

[Bondysbike]

Apparently the R3 is undergoing a revamp. 2020 we will probability see a 2500 cc "muscle bike" with no touring option. Just a big bad ass torque machine.

Don’t hold your breath...it might be a Goldwingesk butthe Balls out Rocket is Now...there won’t be another ...wanna bet

 

[barbagris]

Apparently the R3 is undergoing a revamp. 2020 we will probability see a 2500 cc "muscle bike" with no touring option. Just a big bad ass torque machine.

If it meets the new Euro emmisions and anti-tamper regs.: It might be big but it will be castrated.

I know the secretary of the Spanish MotorCycle mfrs association (that is to say they're in Spain not they represent Spanish marques) - They are seriously worried that bikes over 1000cc will soon NOT be allowed inside major cities - It has already been rumoured in Germany and BMW is a founder of said association here. This will cripple the Boulevard Cruiser Brigade. Last year similar decisions regarding Diesel cars resulted in a huge reduction in the offer of Diesels. And pretty much all small city cars will soon be dual fuel or Hibrid.

The exception will be "Classic" vehicles. By 2020 my 1994 Land rover will qualify and my Guzzi already does - Oh dear how sad!.

 

[Lemieuxfan]

Cam tensioners started out with spring tensioners. Then the aftermarket folks introduced gear driven. Which is Ok but the run out on the pinions ate the gears. Harley came out with the hydraulic system which works rather well but still requires a check at or around 40,000 miles. Inner pad wears first for some reason. The primary automatic tensioner on the Twin cam has been a problem since day one. Way to tight. Primary chain tension ends up eating the bearings. I believe Harley quit using the automatic tensioner on the newer modals but did not leave a window in the primary case to make adjustments on manual tensioners. This results in removal of primary case to make adjustments to primary chain tensioners. Unlike the older models that had a window for such adjustments. 103 models had a real problem with there stators. Harley up graded the stators quickly due to the fact that they were going out while the bikes were still under warranty and was costing them money. The motor compensater was a left over from the 88 cubic inch and worked well on the 96 cubic inch but when they went to the 103 it did not. Later model 103 cubic inch acquired the Screaming eagle compensater but just by design was not getting the proper oil coverage. Harley redesigned and still had problems. Baker an aftermarket company that deals with Motor compenstater and primary tensioners for Harley's makes some quality products that work. Very expensive but American made. Don't get me wrong. Not bashing Harley's but do know the weak points of the twin cam. I work on them a lot. Every new engine design from Harley has resulted in problems. Starting to get folks showing up wanting work done on there Milwaukee eights. So we are still in a learning curb but it has become very apparent that this motor is no exception. It has it's problems. Knowing what I know I tell them sorry take her to the dealership. If I were in the market for a new Harley I would wait a year or two and let the company work the bugs out. I'm sure that once Harley has the chance to figure it out and make the Necessary changes the Milwaukee eight will be a engine that shines.

some very good points sonny; one would think as Harley loses customers due to age and slow adoption/non-existent to HD from skinny jean starbuck drinking millennials they seemed to have rushed to launch this new motor despite some obvious R&D flaws. One wonders as their stock continues to drop they will make a move from current CEO matt levatich; i'm not a harley basher i do feel their motorcycles offer a great solution for the distance rider who wants to travel the US as they have dealerships all over in the event you have an issue. Granted- you will pay about 8-10k grand more for the perceived made in america bike (parts from overseas) also, service money provides a consistent revenue pool which also makes you wonder that Harley is not interested in a 'bullet-proof' motor because it would drain their service stream of revenue for bikes whose warranty has expired etc.

 

[T140v]

If they made some dirt bikes, scramblers, high energy bike’s for mountain roads or at least a cheap commuter bike like a moped they might keep up with today’s younger market. Not everybody wants a big heavy bike they can’t afford. I hate to see people out of work because of poor CEO decision making.

 

[barbagris]

I hate to see people out of work because of poor CEO decision making.

I would hate to be in Matt Levatitch's position.

HD have had (as have many US companies) a tough time merging with other marques (remember the 2stroke Cagiva Harleys).

And he knows the EU market too. Dealt with him directly when I needed papers to bring my Buell to Spain.

But they need a revolution - not an evolution. And they're NOT alone.

 

[scot in exile]

Apparently the R3 is undergoing a revamp. 2020 we will probability see a 2500 cc "muscle bike" with no touring option. Just a big bad ass torque machine.

This has been going around since 2004 still waiting., will be hard for Triumph to justify a new Rocket as the existing one is not a big seller.