Torque loss-RU 2780's

[warp9.9]

With the Pipercross filter, I don't get any slapping, chirping, or squeaking from the throttle bodies.

But I have gotten some slapping and screaming from the passenger seat.

I agree for a NA motor the Pipercross filter realy worked well.

 

[barbagris]

With the Pipercross filter, I don't get any slapping, chirping, or squeaking from the throttle bodies.

This is what we fervently hope for from the RAMAIR.

Colin started talking with Pipercross - and iirc their shortened model went to somebody. But at some stage Piprecross seemed to think it was getting awkward and we discovered RAMAIR who seem more inclined to "have a go".

This is Batterseas baby really.

 

[Battersea]

This is what we fervently hope for from the RAMAIR.

Colin started talking with Pipercross - and iirc their shortened model went to somebody. But at some stage Piprecross seemed to think it was getting awkward and we discovered RAMAIR who seem more inclined to "have a go".

This is Batterseas baby really.

Slight correction Chris, it was ITG not Pipercross - I don't want any litigation papers through the post.

ITG made the first shortened filter that allowed retention of the coolant expansion tank but still needed the bearclaw to be modified, Scott has this at the moment - Was hoping that he could give it a shake down and report back, but his 'off' and the subsequent destruction of 'Gracey' has put that on hold I guess.

ITG just didn't think the latest design was practical to make, hence my contact with Ramair who's attitude was the complete opposite.

 

[CanberraR3]

Actually - no. But I've an R3 mate not far away in Gumiel.

CanberraR3 - there are SUPPOSEDLY differences hidden under the foam. Much as you can't tell a Wayne Tripp Pipercross from a normal Pipercross from the outside. Also it has a lot more surface area (the top is filter too not rubber). And far more internal volume than 3 separate K&N's. But we'll only know when we see the real thing. Frankly I'll be a bit surprised if it looks EXACTLY like that.

Thanks for that explanation. I can see that it would have a lot more internal volume but I doubt the surface area is greater (by much if at all), even with the top being medium. Is the internal volume important? Don't misunderstand me, I think this is great work, but I'm still not clear on the primary goal here. It seemed to start out as an exercise in utilising existing materials (plenum) with the side effect of reducing induction noise and keeping it hidden under the bear claw. Now the focus, or rather the claim, is that it will improve performance over standard and triples. I guess I'm wondering if this is primarily an exercise in aesthetics or are you really building a better mouse trap?

 

[bruce aussie]

Thanks for that explanation. I can see that it would have a lot more internal volume but I doubt the surface area is greater (by much if at all), even with the top being medium. Is the internal volume important? Don't misunderstand me, I think this is great work, but I'm still not clear on the primary goal here. It seemed to start out as an exercise in utilising existing materials (plenum) with the side effect of reducing induction noise and keeping it hidden under the bear claw. Now the focus, or rather the claim, is that it will improve performance over standard and triples. I guess I'm wondering if this is primarily an exercise in aesthetics or are you really building a better mouse trap?

I have been following this with interest Richard and I think the plan is to have something that works as good or better than the tripples, fits under the claw, retains the header tank in it's original position and gets rid of the crickets.
From what has been posted my understanding limited as it may be is that the single large filter will flow more than the triples because only one cylinder at a time draws air. That cylinder would be drawing from the whole filter not just through one pod. Thats my take on it but like I said I don't know if I got it right.

If this ends up working out I would be interested especially if it can be fitted with something like the Gorrilla ram air claw that was featured in a post elsewere.

Battersea would be able to clear up the the air flow thing I think as he appears to know what he is talkin about.

 

[CanberraR3]

I should have been reading......
That makes sense Bruce and helps explain why Cobba's intake seemed to make such a big difference over triples on my bike. Combined surface area of the triples isn't vastly different to the stock filter so that explains why they're a little inadequate. My big K&N may be slight overkill! BTW, my crickets have gone too, although replaced by a very satisfying roar at times. .

 

[bruce aussie]

I should have been reading......
That makes sense Bruce and helps explain why Cobba's intake seemed to make such a big difference over triples on my bike. Combined surface area of the triples isn't vastly different to the stock filter so that explains why they're a little inadequate. My big K&N may be slight overkill! BTW, my crickets have gone too, although replaced by a very satisfying roar at times. .

Yes sorta makes sense to me if I'm understanding it right. I said before a roar would be quite pleasing to the ear I think. Sort of a sound like it would suck a Sportster right in there and spit it out the pipe.

 

[CanberraR3]

Funny you say that. Rode up behind and flew past a mate on his Ninja 750 the other day and that's pretty much what he said. He heard me coming and going; scared the sh1t out of him.

 

[bruce aussie]

When I read that it brought back memories from over 30 years ago back in Kyogle. A good mate had a water bucket with chambers on it. The local coppers pulled me over one night on my Kwaka1000 to ask me were he lived. They said they can hear him coming, they can see him going but they can't catch him. I had to tell them I didn't know him and I had never seen a matt black 2 stroke road bike with no exhaust in town.
They never did catch him on that bike.

 

[barbagris]

It seemed to start out as an exercise in utilising existing materials (plenum) with the side effect of reducing induction noise and keeping it hidden under the bear claw.

Now the focus, or rather the claim, is that it will improve performance over standard and triples. I guess I'm wondering if this is primarily an exercise in aesthetics or are you really building a better mouse trap?

Actually the plenum mod was sort of an intermediate step (in my case) to test the fact that the triumph rubber bell mouths work better than simple K&N triples at reducing unwanted noise due to poor inlet resonance - They do, ime. Colin was already talking with ITG (not Pipercross ).

The aim is a better filter that supplies better air flow to the engine - certainly from RAMAIRS POV - they're keen to get Dyno results. I've already suggested they talk to Wayne Tripp. My hope is it's also cacophony-free.

All filters offer SOME airflow resistance. The more pre filtered air you have behind the filter ready for the engine to suck in - the better it is. If it's also in correctly tuned length runners it will boost torque.

The top being filter media probably adds a good 15% smoother air flow, as well as more area. The engine can suck some air STRAIGHT in. I don't KNOW - but I believe the K&N's create turbulence rather than flow at times. The PCV trim tables suggest there are moments where simply the air flow gets f*cked up.

The easier you make the airflow transition (radiused inlets) the better it is. This alone can add 16% flow. If the radius is elliptical - more still.

The RU2780's are a standard filter that fits under the claw. Nothing else. My reason for trying them was for improved access to idle adjustment screws.

Under normal fast road up to a ton - honestly the OEM plenum seems to offer a more flexible engine response. The modified plenum is a bit more snarly and responds better at larger throttle openings.

Patience - By end September I hope I'll have one in and tested.