TORS v Jardines

warp9.9 said:

I am sure Bob could have worked out the dip with further changesespecially altering the timing. Its hard saying when your not sure what has been done. You are right though the pipes were made for higher output engines and the Preds were made for stocker set up. I know Bob was busy and had to get the bike done and since Larry was switching to the Carpenter pipe there was no reason to play with a pipe that will not be built again. Larry's had the ceramic coating peeling off, So di Stew Pred. Mine held up so far but the Heat shield brackets welded to the header pipe are not that good. I lost one on each header. Add a rattle sound to the pipe
Massive Torque down low is alright if your pulling a haywagon or 3 bottom plow. But top end is what will win the race even if its on the street. And well we all know these beast have plenty of torque as it is stock.

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Bike is still down at Fastermotorsports, along with charts. High end HP gains were impressive, not so in the midrange. When I can retrieve the bike and the chart I'll post the results with and without nitrous. Jury is still out. I do and don't like the pipes. Since I've come this far it's too late to change course now. I'll probably get the intake they are developing currently and the 210 kit next Fall. The pipes are very attractive, very loud and produce hp gains on the top end of the RPM scale, midrange is a bust. No opinion one way or another from me yet. We'll see what a baffle does.

hanso said:

I checked out the welds when the headers came and they appeared just fine but will keep my eye on them the header fitted perfectly, maybe your's might have a fault (were they one of his early ones) as for the ceramic coating he is not the one who did it he merely had someone do it so you can't blame him there, the only issue I have seen is the heat shield bolts working loose but I have not had an issue after retightening while letting everything settle in over a couple of hundred Klm

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My header welds were fine the only welds that did not hold up are the little threaded female mounts on each header pipe. these are the ones that the heat shield bolts go into. Hopefully your will hold up and you will not have any worries. I will probably get them fixed by a local welder we have here that does stainless propellers for boats.
Then who knows I guess I will hang them on the wall for a while till I decide whether or not to take the Jardines off Gracie.
As for the ceramic coating I realise Sam did not do this he farmed it out and at least mine shipped straight from the ceramic coaters.

dracul said:

Bike is still down at Fastermotorsports, along with charts. High end HP gains were impressive, not so in the midrange. When I can retrieve the bike and the chart I'll post the results with and without nitrous. Jury is still out. I do and don't like the pipes. Since I've come this far it's too late to change course now. I'll probably get the intake they are developing currently and the 210 kit next Fall. The pipes are very attractive, very loud and produce hp gains on the top end of the RPM scale, midrange is a bust. No opinion one way or another from me yet. We'll see what a baffle does.

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So Drac what type of tuning aid is the dyno shop using on yours?

by the way I have the PCV with Auto Tune and love it since I set up my own AFR tables (copied Wayne Tripp's) the old girl ain't a rocket shes a low flying missile and when I get a chance and have spare $175 to waste I take it up to the Dyno again and do pull to see the figures and see what she is putting out now

warp9.9 said:

So Drac what type of tuning aid is the dyno shop using on yours?

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PCIII. Any suggestions?

PCIII is good but it will not make timing changes. Even if you use the Gigpro ATRE stuff most tuners like Wayne Tripp still move timing around a bit and see what happens to the power, especially in the upper areas. I have seen him pull as much as three degrees out. I imagine you pulled your secondary's since you can not open them to 100% with the PC unit alone.
What are you using to add fuel when in NOS mode?

dracul said:

PCIII. Any suggestions?

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forget the PCIII use a PCV and once you have Dyno'd to get a good base map (or run a Pred or whatever TuneECU map u like) run the Auto Tune and it will keep it running at its best. the web sites say the PCV is only for 09 and later but that is BS read some of the other treads about it, a few of us have them now and are loving them some guys have them on 05 models i have mine on a 08 they developed the PCV on a 09 but they all use the same ECU connecters an it works jus fine

hanso said:

forget the PCIII use a PCV and once you have Dyno'd to get a good base map (or run a Pred or whatever TuneECU map u like) run the Auto Tune and it will keep it running at its best. the web sites say the PCV is only for 09 and later but that is BS read some of the other treads about it, a few of us have them now and are loving them some guys have them on 05 models i have mine on a 08 they developed the PCV on a 09 but they all use the same ECU connecters an it works jus fine

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Cool. Alright, I'll try this route then.

My advice, Larry, aka dracul, would be to save your money on the PCV and the dyno tune and put the 210 kit in, which is what you should have done from the get-go. That would have saved you from needless trial and tribulation, plus your bike would be set up to perfection.

Man, it sure is easy spending other people's money!

warp9.9 said:

My header welds were fine the only welds that did not hold up are the little threaded female mounts on each header pipe. these are the ones that the heat shield bolts go into. Hopefully your will hold up and you will not have any worries. I will probably get them fixed by a local welder we have here that does stainless propellers for boats.
Then who knows I guess I will hang them on the wall for a while till I decide whether or not to take the Jardines off Gracie.
As for the ceramic coating I realise Sam did not do this he farmed it out and at least mine shipped straight from the ceramic coaters.

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well scottie.. as i recall some triumph bungs have pulled out of the manifold . are you trying to tell me my welds failed ? dont think so skippy. bung material may have but not the welds. be interesting to see how those "spring retainers" hold up on the carps.. hondas gw frames cracked and they sure the fck tested them for 1000's of hours.. how many years and miles have you had yours ? as for ceramics.. interestingly enough when you use chemicals to clean / polish the engine( sp200 and others )it interacts with the ceramic causing it to loose adhesion so far in the black not chromex.. course since the ceramic manufactures just found this out recently i guess i was supposed to know this however many years in advance..
i find it comical that art runs a dyno and pulls 11 hp less than thug headers into a 3 set up staintune muffler.. ya imagine that... real odd how the dyno gradually tappers near the end.. any other dyno it runs then drops like a rock when it hits the rev limit.. dont care if it's stocker or whatever.
"as for mine shipped straight from ceramics".. wtf are you trying to imply there .. ?
you know scott i get it.. you dont like the preds and think i ripped you off some how.. why dont you just man - the - fck up and say so. ill tell ya .. it really pisses me off i ever put any hours into making you something.. it bugs the crap out of me to think something i put time and effort into was on your bike for 3 or whatever years.
make sure ol art posts up the dynos showing how they arrived at a 2 " od as "the best".. im sure they built a 1 5/8 , 1 3/4, 1 7/8 ,2 like i did to see what worked best.. yep maybe i just missed those dyno's.