BigNorm
Boobie Inspector
Tell me more tell me more. Thanks for posting up Penner. I love timing talk.
Paul Bryant
Living Legend
Yea' Norm, ignition is not some thing that is talked about much, maybe that's because nothing much needs doing. I don't know so read anything and everything about this.
BigNorm
Boobie Inspector
I like that he posted his results on a modified bike. It kind of gives us po folks a safe area in which we can play with.
Claviger
Aspiring Student
- Joined
- Jul 25, 2014
- Messages
- 6,934
- Location
- Olympia Washington
- Ride
- '21 Z H2, '14 R3R, '02 Daytona 955i
As a point of reference to see what's safe, you can pull up the oldest stock Rocket 3 tunes in TuneECU. Compare those to the new Roadster files.
You'll notice they gutted the mid range timing while keeping the higher RPM the same in the Roadster tune. I found great response on my bike by grafting the original tables into the Roadster tune, then smoothing the values using the visual graph adjustment function in TuneECU to ensure there are no big/sharp transitions across RPM for a given throttle opening. The result was improved throttle response, but, it does require a fuel table re-tune to take full advantage of the increased timing.
Another strong data point is the timing table in the Powertripp R3T slip-on tune.
Remember timing is a window not a specific value in most cases (and in particular it's so with the R3 motor), within that window, you will make identical power. In a perfect tune you'll be using the lower end of that window for your timing and retain the most detonation/ping prevention capability while pushing more heat into the exhaust instead of the head.
All of these known good tunes will provide you with some strong data.
Another point to consider, as Triumph grew as a brand they gained access to more markets, its been 15 years since the R3 first arrived. Those emerging markets often will not have the consistency (even though it's still terrible) of fuels we have in their more established markets UK/AUS/USA/EU etc. Triumph will have had to adjust for those conditions, and it may be why they reduced roadster timing, to allow for some very very poor quality fuels without any issues (looking at countries that allow high amounts of ethanol/impurities in their fuels).
You'll notice they gutted the mid range timing while keeping the higher RPM the same in the Roadster tune. I found great response on my bike by grafting the original tables into the Roadster tune, then smoothing the values using the visual graph adjustment function in TuneECU to ensure there are no big/sharp transitions across RPM for a given throttle opening. The result was improved throttle response, but, it does require a fuel table re-tune to take full advantage of the increased timing.
Another strong data point is the timing table in the Powertripp R3T slip-on tune.
Remember timing is a window not a specific value in most cases (and in particular it's so with the R3 motor), within that window, you will make identical power. In a perfect tune you'll be using the lower end of that window for your timing and retain the most detonation/ping prevention capability while pushing more heat into the exhaust instead of the head.
All of these known good tunes will provide you with some strong data.
Another point to consider, as Triumph grew as a brand they gained access to more markets, its been 15 years since the R3 first arrived. Those emerging markets often will not have the consistency (even though it's still terrible) of fuels we have in their more established markets UK/AUS/USA/EU etc. Triumph will have had to adjust for those conditions, and it may be why they reduced roadster timing, to allow for some very very poor quality fuels without any issues (looking at countries that allow high amounts of ethanol/impurities in their fuels).
Grumpy Ole Codger
Miserable as FECK
Gregger
Living Legend
I prefer a good glass of red wine.....
