Attention ALL Electrical Guru's

[Rocket Scientist]

As I mentioned In another tread - I would take the instruments to an automotive instrument service guy to diagnose and test the gauges as the problem would most likely be in the gauges, but the gauges could also be reporting exactly what it is being sent in a bad signal/voltage etc sadly this will be a process of elimination.

Fortunately electronic troubleshooting is what I do for a living. The big difference is, with production machines, they want you to know how they work so you can keep them running, make money and buy more of their machines. I'm thinking I'd be hard pressed to get any info from Triumph on how that whole system works.

 

[Mittzy]

Fortunately electronic troubleshooting is what I do for a living. The big difference is, with production machines, they want you to know how they work so you can keep them running, make money and buy more of their machines. I'm thinking I'd be hard pressed to get any info from Triumph on how that whole system works.

Just saying if you cant find the fault or if the guage/s are faulty might save you $ getting them looked at.
someone like this: http://www.bobsspeedometer.com/1/120/index.asp

 

[STRIPES]

Fred,

Don't you recall....that was the "gremlin" I fought for over a year. I thought you helped me with it at the last RAA. My guru at Alien said the only thing it could be (because everything else was changed) was the processor in the gauges. Like you, I know nothing of them so my only option was to replace the gauges.
Voila! Fixed. They aren't cheap.

 

[barbagris]

I tried moving the relays around. All the relay terminals are clean and greased. @barbagris I agree it could simply be the speedo dying. Whats puzzling is that the entire sweep / idiot light test sequence has disappeared, unless I unplug the engine management relay. Then it does the test sequence fine with the exception of the speedo not sweeping. As for can-bus, I'm not sure either. I thought I read somewhere they did. There are an awful lot of wires going to the guages. You wouldn't think you'd need more than a couple if it were can-bus. I'll have to pick up another speedo for test purposes.

Fred - I'm not 100% sure but I believe we have the ODO counter inside the SPEEDO - Roadsters onwards the ODO is in the ECU.

Maybe reading through the "How I did it" threads from folk who've fitted a Dakota Digital or similar will help.

I guess it depends on your interpretation of CAN BUS - If you mean a wire from the ECU LIGHTS THE LED - This is NOT A BUS. If you mean there's logic at both ends and the data is interpreted in the receiver - then NO I don't think we do.

Bear in mind that, especially with low volt/amp electronics, it's possible that a faulty feed wire can and will cause false earth and all sorts of shenanigins. I've seen a poorly earthed wire elsewhere on the bike cause the Main beam LED to come on. And a dried our solder or defective circuit inside the clock and you're stuffed.

I read somewhere a thread by Wayne Tripp where he covered all instrument wire colours and what they fed. - But he did not use the Triumph SPEED PULSE output from the ECU. There was a post about fitting a Dakota Digital - but I cannot find it. It was also on the dot com site - but has gone - It's referenced from here but is no more. I'm sure he did use the Speedo pulse. Suggests to me we have NO BUS. Simply outputs from ECU.

Sage words from Mitzy - if you have a GAUGE GUY close - use him. If not I'll see if I can work out which wires go where from my spare set. I actually bought them initially to have the LOOM so I could do a conversion to different clocks. The Clocks as it transpired came with it NIB. Just never did the swap - but it's time to investigate.

BUT IF IT WERE ME - I'D ASSUME THE WORST AND START LOOKING. Either Triumph or Non-Standard.

DEcosse would be your man - but he's a long way away. Ken is better at electronics than I ever wish to be.

 

[Mittzy]

Fred - I'm not 100% sure but I believe we have the ODO counter inside the SPEEDO - Roadsters onwards the ODO is in the ECU.

Maybe reading through the "How I did it" threads from folk who've fitted a Dakota Digital or similar will help.

I guess it depends on your interpretation of CAN BUS - If you mean a wire from the ECU LIGHTS THE LED - This is NOT A BUS. If you mean there's logic at both ends and the data is interpreted in the receiver - then NO I don't think we do.

Bear in mind that, especially with low volt/amp electronics, it's possible that a faulty feed wire can and will cause false earth and all sorts of shenanigins. I've seen a poorly earthed wire elsewhere on the bike cause the Main beam LED to come on. And a dried our solder or defective circuit inside the clock and you're stuffed.

I read somewhere a thread by Wayne Tripp where he covered all instrument wire colours and what they fed. - But he did not use the Triumph SPEED PULSE output from the ECU. There was a post about fitting a Dakota Digital - but I cannot find it. It was also on the dot com site - but has gone - It's referenced from here but is no more. I'm sure he did use the Speedo pulse. Suggests to me we have NO BUS. Simply outputs from ECU.

Sage words from Mitzy - if you have a GAUGE GUY close - use him. If not I'll see if I can work out which wires go where from my spare set. I actually bought them initially to have the LOOM so I could do a conversion to different clocks. The Clocks as it transpired came with it NIB. Just never did the swap - but it's time to investigate.

BUT IF IT WERE ME - I'D ASSUME THE WORST AND START LOOKING. Either Triumph or Non-Standard.

DEcosse would be your man - but he's a long way away. Ken is better at electronics than I ever wish to be.

At least worth a phone call.

 

[DEcosse]

...... Roadsters onwards the ODO is in the ECU......

Don't think so, still in the instruments

... I read somewhere a thread by Wayne Tripp where he covered all instrument wire colours and what they fed.....

I ID'd the wiring right here in R3Owners.net - http://www.r3owners.net/threads/instrument-replacement.20608/#post-287645

There is no CANBUS on the the R3/Classics - only on Roadsters and Touring with the later ECU. Everything has a discrete signal, so after-market gauge can be used if desired on these models

 

[Rocket Scientist]

THAT is valuable bit of info there, thanks ! Any idea how the guage sweep / idiot light test sequence works ? Does that originate in the guages themselves when they first receive the "ignition power" signal, or does it come from the ECM ?

 

[Rocket Scientist]

Fred,

Don't you recall....that was the "gremlin" I fought for over a year. I thought you helped me with it at the last RAA. My guru at Alien said the only thing it could be (because everything else was changed) was the processor in the gauges. Like you, I know nothing of them so my only option was to replace the gauges.
Voila! Fixed. They aren't cheap.

It's all coming back to me now Like a repressed memory A question for you Ken, when you replaced your guages did your total mileage go to zero ? As I recall your knackered speedo kept the total mileage but would lose the trip data (like mine is doing).

 

[DEcosse]

The sweep generation is internal to the clock at power-up
There appears to be a loss of the constant power connection - that is what keeps the volatile memory powered, that holds the data for the trip (and in other bikes that have one, the clock time); the actual odo is stored in non-volatile memory and clock can sit on a shelf for 10 years and it would still be there

 

[Rocket Scientist]

The sweep generation is internal to the clock at power-up
There appears to be a loss of the constant power connection - that is what keeps the volatile memory powered, that holds the data for the trip (and in other bikes that have one, the clock time); the actual odo is stored in non-volatile memory and clock can sit on a shelf for 10 years and it would still be there

Thanks again ! I know feel educated enough to tackle this !