Tune Clarify

Discussion in 'Trading Tunes' started by Psydone, Jun 27, 2006.

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  1. Psydone

    Psydone.020 Over

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    Pig9r can you clarify the difference between the smoothdecel tune and the smoothdecel2 tune.

    In smoothdecel you say "I have maddogs, no cat, and undertank K&N."

    In smoothdecel2 you say "Rocket III Full power with catalyst"

    The tune edit program both of them have a description that ses "with catalyst"
     
  2. Toystoretom

    ToystoretomLiving Legend

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    The way I'm reading this is ...

    The base tune Pig9r is using is the Stevedyno tune... which happens to use a catalyst.

    The tunes are being run and tested on Pig9r's own bike which doesn't have a catalyst.

    The only real difference between smoothdecel1 and smoothdecel2 is the amount of fuel added in certain areas of the map to kill decel popping

    ,,, smoothdecel1 adds 8% and 13% in some map cells

    ... smoothdecel2 adds 10% and 15% in some map cells

    In theory smoothdecel2 is richer and should have less popping than smoothdecel1.

    There may be a misprint? in the description for smoothdecel2 about the catalyst as compared to smoothdecel1?..

    At this point the equipment being used is moot... we have what we have and for awhile one size is going to fit all. The reason we are posting these is that we hope people with different kinds of equipment will try these and give us feedback on how they work. These are not finished tunes. If you want exact tunes for your specific equipment... you will have to develop your own. If you don't feel comfortable loading these into your bike and don't have the skill or knowledge to modify your own maps for your setup, I strongly suggest that you don't do it.

    I am not fingerpointing at Mr. Psydone here... I just wanted to make the point that our tune library is very small and we only have a small amount of time to work on it or add to it. This whole process is confusing... and for right now we really only have one tune based on the Stevedyno tune that has some improvements and extra features added to it.

    We will look at this to try and make it more.... ? sensable ? easier to read?
     
  3. Pig9r

    Pig9rLiving Legend

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    Tom is correct. I basically added to the edit notes in each tune. The first few lines are what Wayne added when he did SteveRed's bike the last few are the changes I made. In the TuneEdit program there is an area to save "notes" I just copy those straight from TuneEdit and paste them here. I note what my set up is for comparison purposes and as Tom pointed out the more people that download and try it we can note their responses. That doesn't necessarily mean that it won't work on another type of set up.

    We are merely getting in the ballpark, a dyno tune would be more specific. And that's what is going to need to happen is there are going to need to be dyno tunes for each specific set up. Hopefully I can get mine dyno tuned in the near future. Smoothdecel2 is richer than Smoothdecel. I would suggest start with Smoothdecel and then move to Smoothdecel2 if popping still continues. Once again it depends on the intake and exhaust setups.

    Once we start getting more feedback we can make changes and maybe develop some more specific tunes for each application. Keep in mind also that someone may have the same set up but if one person is on the coast in Austriala and the other is in Denver, Colorado the tune may not work the same because of altitude differences.

    I will go through the tunes again and make sure the notes are consistent.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2006
  4. Psydone

    Psydone.020 Over

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    Ahhhhh but you are missing my point for asking these questions lads, don't assume anything.

    I'm writing a piece of catalogue/library software that will snapin to the tune edit program, a HUGE discussion on these forums is how "hard" tuneboy is to use, so how about someone with some software dev skills (ME) write something to catalogue and list what these tunes are, where they come from how they work and who is running them, what their bikes are, possibly ratings etc etc. The catalogue will also have a "Tell TuneEdit I wanna use this one" button so that when you open the tuneedit program the desired tune is pre-selected and all you have to do is hit "download".

    The equipment you have is not moot because the non techy is going to ask "this is my setup x y z, what tune do i run?" this forum isn't the best place to keep track of this type of info, how many different tunes will be out there in the end? how big is a post topic going to get and how annoying is it going to be with ambiguous descriptions and a post list that is a mile long with 5000 different setups and tunes?

    Don't you think if I could release a tool with consolidated tunes with creator AND user comments consolidated and documented in one central point it would be a huge step forward in getting MORE people to test and try tunes aswell as provide the neccessary feedback for the gurus to create better tunes. Open up the "TuneCat" program type in "Jardines" and it will filter all the tunes the have jardine pipes listed as a setup mod, further type some other mod and the filter gets smaller, suddenly its down to two tunes(Tune A and Tune B) in the program ToyStore has rated Tune A as "10" and ToyStore has rated tune B as "9" a description of WHY Toystores Rating is 10 on A is shown, "Tune B was way to much power down low and I will kill myself with it, this tune is much more manageable"
    Based on this scenario a newbie can say I WANT THE POWER and set the tune to tune B, tell the tunedit program thats what he wants to load to his bike and voila its that simple. Based on his experience with the new tune he can feed that back into "TuneCat" and with the click of a button upload his feedback into a central location where others can pull this info down from.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2006
  5. Pig9r

    Pig9rLiving Legend

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    I understand what you are trying to to do and it is an excellent idea. However it is so early in the game I don't want to categorize these tunes as they should work with any set up. It's not going to be until there are specific dyno tunes that it will matter to get into specifics or once these tunes get more 'polished.' For example almost everyone runs the Stevedyno tune, which is a dyno tune for standard intake, staintune pipes with cat. However almost everyone, no matter what their set up, raves about the results of this tune. It's not a bike specific tune but something that is "in the ballpark." And Wayne didn't even touch any of the A/F ratios with that tune either so it is no where near a finished product.

    Skorous2, DougL, Tom and I are about the only ones thus far to try anything other than the canned tunes and report results. There are still a lot of areas of TuneEdit that I haven't begun to think about yet.

    Hopefully more people will have luck with creating tunes and more people will have dyno tunes to share. Please don't get frustrated with me as I am just want to learn how to tune and use the Tuneboy.

    I will do whatever that will make your project go easier however at this stage it would be impossible to nail down A,B and C specifics.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2006
  6. Psydone

    Psydone.020 Over

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    All good pig9r, Your doing some great work, and I love what your doing just trying to make sure the computer nerd (me) that is trying to "Sort & Catalogue" these tunes is doing the right thing when detailing them.
     
  7. dougl

    douglLiving Legend

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    Regarding exhaust configurations, I have the TOR/cat bypass. The 20050Staintune.dat (SteveDyno) tunes apparently was done on a bike with Staintune exhaust but with the cat.

    This tune is definitely an improvement over the 20054. Besides opening up the secondaries all the time and correcting the speedo, it added fuel according to dyno runs. It backfires in the pipes on my bike but no worse than with the 20054. But it's more responsive and smoother. Since this tune is richer than the stock ones, I don't see why it, or the decel tunes from Pig9r, won't be an improvement for any of the aftermarket exhausts out there.
     
  8. THE PUNISHER

    THE PUNISHERSupercharged

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    Stevereds tune might list it as having a cat but it does not.
    He is running Staintune pipes which come with there own catbypass pipe.I have seen it.
     
  9. dougl

    douglLiving Legend

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    Thanks for the clarification. So that tune should work pretty well for the TOR/ cat bypass.
     
  10. Toystoretom

    ToystoretomLiving Legend

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    Okay... :D So we basically have this...

    The Original Stevedyno tune that was made from a bike that had a Staintune exhaust, and that was based on the original Triumph 20050 tune...

    We took that tune and applied it to a Bike that has a K&N under tank air filter, cat bypass, and Mad Dogs. Some features were added (Speedo corrected, secondary butterflies opened, fuel injection curve smoothed out in the area where Triumph was trying to pass EPA noise test, and addressed decel popping). This mutated into 2 tunes: Smoothdecel1 and Smoothdecel2. We didn't really make any changes because of equipment issues... ie we went from Staintune to Mad Dogs with cat by pass

    And that is pretty much the history of this deal so far. I may have a completely different setup this weekend which will merge the PC III with the Tuneboy. This will have a a great deal more "Umph" on the bottom end of things, ie boost horsepower and torque from about 1000 to 3000 rpms. The PC III tunes actually work and stay put after you make changes... the TuneBoy tunes seem to revert back to a default setting each time through EPROM? and it is very frustrating, so I'm not even going to use TuneBoy fuel maps on this one... but there are other features that I have been playing with and it is promising so far.

    We are also looking at ways to defeat the EPROM so that the TuneBoy tunes stay "put". Right now... it seems like if you make a change with TuneBoy it works for a week or so and then it slips right back into its old nasty habits. Then you have to redo it and go through the cycle again. We have two theories to test... we just don't have the time..
     
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