Something Failed, let’s find it! Transmission Analysis.

How many wives?...I stopped at one...they're too d@mn expensive!


HA ! :D
Yea' a friend of mine once said that he spent time and energy working on his marriage for a couple of reasons.
A) It would cost him serious amounts of coin if they split up, and .....
B) He's taken this long to get her trained just right, he couldn't be bothered starting that all over again :D
 
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We have a winner:

3rd gear circlip wasn’t seated. Everything looks to be assembled correctly, not surprised by that.
 
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@albertaduke Finally a good news story!

I’ve identified the clack/slap/ feel and it’s innocuous and a false danger sign!!

It comes from the way 5th gear is undercut. All the gears and dogs besides 5th are designed differently so he can fully backcut the height of the gear side of the interface.

5th is different. See the pics below. 5th has a weld at the base of the gear teeth. It’s not back cut into the weld, but the dog can extend further in that the weld. What’s happening is the back cut shape is drawing in the 3/4 dogged gear closer to the 6th input gear, it slides over the weld and slips. Then it meets up with the back cut shap and slides over the weld and repeats.

This explains why more throttle makes it stop and more RPM. Increased speed or load will lock the dogs and prevent it from riding up the weld. Yours is 2500 vs my 3000 issue, this will be dictated by torque and the angle of the cut on the back cut.

Ride on, worry not, it’s a non issue. I should say, if he were to back cut it more, the gear's strength would be in question because he'd be cutting into the weld material. Basically, he did the best he could to provide lockup without compromising the strength of the teeth, given the way the stock gear is manufactured.

I believe the reason it stopped on my bike over time, was the faces wear into each other and fully seat. Once seated fully they provide better lock up over time giving it more grip between dogs/teeth and preventing it from riding up the welded portion.
 

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How far I was able to easily slide 4th gear because the 3rd gear circlip had moved....
bad circlip 2.jpg

I slid the 2-3 dog back down against 3rd and the circlip popped back into it's slot, and now the wiggle is gone that 3rd/4th had in the video i made.

1st, 2nd, and 5th look fantastic, as do the shafts and really, everything else.

The drum looks like it's never been used... it's flawless.

What caused 3rd gear's circlip to jump out of the groove, now there's the question. The direction it moves when it's forced out of the groove is in the direction of a 5th to 4th downshift (3/4 share a input gear which doubles as the 5th gear dog gear), and that is the only normal movement that can cause side loads onto 3rd gear. Side load could also be generated in a failed 4-5 upshift if the dogs bounced instead of engaging when you shifted. I've never had a failed 4-5 up shift, so I can only conclude that being heavy footed in 5 to 4 downshifts is the cause, as there is no other normal action in the transmission that could possibly cause the circlip to get pushed.

Unless one of the much smarter guys here knows something I don't about how this whole apparatus works, I consider the mystery solved.

Lead foot 5-4 downshifts = dislocated circlip = wobbling third and fourth ouput gear = time bomb waiting to explode when and if 3rd wobbles.

I do have to own this, I am heavy footed in 4-5 downshifts using a NORMAL shift pattern. I can remember fairly aggressively kicking down a gear from 5th to 4th when I was using the normal shift pattern (now think about what a 4-5 downshift is using GP shift, its an UPWARD movement, you absolutely cannot generate the same force going up).

I will be sticking with GP shift, I don't stomp or kick up shifts with clicking down on the lever, and I 100% do not think it had anything at all to do with the damage that is visible.
 
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The only caveat i would add is to question the orientation of the circlip. Mine was clearly fitted with the stamped ergo rounded side facing out, making it much easier to ride out of the groove.
 
We both speak from experience lol

Can you both recall being guilty of a quick 5-4 downshift that maybe was a little rough? Such as, when your cruising and a fellow rider takes off, so you grab a gear to keep up, or passing on the freeway and find you need more go power suddenly?

Certainly a backwards circlip would make it a hell of a lot easier to pop the thing loose, but I think the root cause is really rough 5-4 shifts.
 
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