Braking during cornering

Front trail braking has become more of a thing in racing since the advent of sophisticated electronic rider aids. But there's a big difference between "applying" the front brake once you've already entered the turn - ie. going from off to on while the bike is mid-corner - and never completey releasing the front brake through the trun once the initial hard braking is completed. I would never grab a handful of front brake mid-corner from nothing. The danger is dive. But if you've steadily released brake pressure but never fully let go, that's different. But again, todays electronics deal with dive and in theory cornering ABS will save you in a panic brake situation. But it goes without saying, that situation should never arise.
If I do find myself misjudging a bend and going on too hot (and it happens) I just lift my head, focus on the exit - which will cause you to instinctively put in more countersteer because the bike will go where you look - and use the rear brake to do any slowing that is required. If you don't panic, look up and look out of the bend, and scrub excess speed off gently with the rear, you have far more time than you think.

The reason I rear trail so much on my KTM is that it has long travel non-active suspension. It's also non-adjustable except via preset modes. These are very good but you can't dial in extra compression damping prior to commencing an aggressive ride. You get what you're given. Even so, it's very well damped in Sport mode and it's such an agile chassis with so much leverage from the wide bars and a centralised mass, it rewards braking deep into a turn and turning very late at the last moment. This puts a lot of load on the front tyre which makes the bike feel thoroughly glued down and inspires enormous confidence at acute lean angles - which is why the bike is so good at hustling sports bikes. But it you hold a lot of front brake right up to the instant you tip the bike in without having been able to stiffen up the damping beforehand, when you release it the front suspension will rebound and unload the front tyre. This will cost you that confidence-inspiring glued down feeling but it will also cause the bike to understeer and unless you conciously add more counter-steer it is likely to run wide. This does not make for happy scratching. But, if you brush in just a whisker of rear brake as the front comes off that stops that rearward rebound and keeps the chassis settled and flat and doesn't slow the steering. You release it completely when you see the exit and dial in the gas again.

It should be said though, all this applies in bends which are taken while still on the power. On slower, very tight turns when the power is shut off, the tried and tested slow in, fast out maxim still rules.

I have to say that i'm impressed with your ability to describe everything that you are doing in the corner and why you're doing it.
I'm not sure I have that ability. Either because I haven't analysed closely enough as to what i'm doing or that, I don't know what i'm doing at all (lol...) and it's just is what it is. All subconscious.....what I call 'natural'.
I probably need to analyse and take more note as to what i'm doing. The basics of what i'm doing is there, but certainly not everything, as I think it changes, so much when the atmospheric conditions and road surfaces change.

One thing I do know, is that i've always preferred the cornering character of a torque'y bike than a rev'y one, because the engine braking is doing a lot for you both in entering and exiting the corner. So there's much less braking going on.

I also really like trail bikes more than sports bikes generally, riding the tight hilly roads. I can make so much more progress due the the longer suspension travel above and beyond the size of contact patch on the front tyre or the tautness of the chassis.

I can recall going out on a KTM RC8 for the first time on a road safety event hosted by the local Police as part of the 'Bike Safe' initiative.
Picture the scene.....there's me, getting my hands on an LC8 and all I want to do is get into the bikes natural flow state as quickly as possible, so everything is nice and smooth, but the event is in the city and i've got a Police rider behind me watching my every move. Accessing my 'safe' riding abilities. Traffic lights galore, Saturday afternoon traffic....not the best situation to be test riding an LC8.
I remember the only thing he was not happy about, and that was the fact that I was riding with only one (or two) finger(s) over the front brake. I told him that due to the traffic and general low speed riding, coupled with the bike having more stopping power than the bike I arrived on, I was trying to make sure that I had some continual cover over the front brake while still having a good grip of the low handlebars. He really wasn't in the mood to listen to my reasoning and was almost insistent that I used all my fingers over the front brake........Neither of us were happy on that little escapade.....Lol...
 
I have to say that i'm impressed with your ability to describe everything that you are doing in the corner and why you're doing it.
I'm not sure I have that ability. Either because I haven't analysed closely enough as to what i'm doing or that, I don't know what i'm doing at all (lol...) and it's just is what it is. All subconscious.....what I call 'natural'.
I probably need to analyse and take more note as to what i'm doing. The basics of what i'm doing is there, but certainly not everything, as I think it changes, so much when the atmospheric conditions and road surfaces change.

One thing I do know, is that i've always preferred the cornering character of a torque'y bike than a rev'y one, because the engine braking is doing a lot for you both in entering and exiting the corner. So there's much less braking going on.

I also really like trail bikes more than sports bikes generally, riding the tight hilly roads. I can make so much more progress due the the longer suspension travel above and beyond the size of contact patch on the front tyre or the tautness of the chassis.

I can recall going out on a KTM RC8 for the first time on a road safety event hosted by the local Police as part of the 'Bike Safe' initiative.
Picture the scene.....there's me, getting my hands on an LC8 and all I want to do is get into the bikes natural flow state as quickly as possible, so everything is nice and smooth, but the event is in the city and i've got a Police rider behind me watching my every move. Accessing my 'safe' riding abilities. Traffic lights galore, Saturday afternoon traffic....not the best situation to be test riding an LC8.
I remember the only thing he was not happy about, and that was the fact that I was riding with only one (or two) finger(s) over the front brake. I told him that due to the traffic and general low speed riding, coupled with the bike having more stopping power than the bike I arrived on, I was trying to make sure that I had some continual cover over the front brake while still having a good grip of the low handlebars. He really wasn't in the mood to listen to my reasoning and was almost insistent that I used all my fingers over the front brake........Neither of us were happy on that little escapade.....Lol...
Talking of police riders, I did an advanced course a few years ago with Rapid Training, who are all serving or former police riders. They're independent, not representing the police on the day and they ride their own bikes, but they teach a lot of the techniques that police pursuit riders use to be quick, smooth and in control. They covered a lot of the stuff I was talking about above, as well as road positioning, forward observation, timing, braking etc.
It was some of the best money I've ever spent and I thoroughly recommend them to anyone, whatever their current skill level and whatever stage they're at in their riding career.

When it comes to the KTM, it is one of the most flattering bikes I've ever had. It brings out the best in your abilities and helps you understand what's going on. A really good adventure/ trail/supermoto can do that like few other bikes, which is probably why you like them.
Sports bikes are actually not that easy to ride. They're single-minded and focused and they assume you know what you're doing before you start. If you've already got good habits and technique they will reward them. But they're far from the best kind if bike to learn those techniques on to start with.

When I did my Rapid training there were two of us and the other rider was a young lad not long passed his test, on a GSXR 750. I was on a 1050 Speed Triple. The instructor did say to us that the other lad really had the wrong bike to learn on. He would have been better learning the techniques on one like mine and then graduating to his GSXR. Not because it is fast but because the machine itself demands a lot of your attention when really it's the road environment you should be concentrating on. the lad in question did find this difficult. To he credit he started going on track days afterwards where he could concentrate better on what he'd learned.
 
..........I do miss my Adventure 990s, but I had to sell it because I knew I would lose my licence if I kept on enjoying myself on it 😅

KTM-990AdventureS_04.JPG



....and remember....... The front brake is useless sometimes.... ;)

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..........I do miss my Adventure 990s, but I had to sell it because I knew I would lose my licence if I kept on enjoying myself on it 😅

KTM-990AdventureS_04.JPG



....and remember....... The front brake is useless sometimes.... ;)

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I miss my 990 SMT. I had it so well sorted - eventually. It was an absolute rip-snorter. A proper giant supermoto.
Oh for those glory days when KTM made proper KTMs....
 
I miss my 990 SMT. I had it so well sorted - eventually. It was an absolute rip-snorter. A proper giant supermoto.
Oh for those glory days when KTM made proper KTMs....

Not ridden any KTM's since about 2013'ish.
I did wonder if I should have gone for one of the latest full fat Superdukes' instead of going down my BottPower route, but I couldn't help myself.
I can't shake off my old school attitude to engine character.....That, and maybe I prefer a challenge.......oh, and then the fact that it isn't as easy to hide on an orange bike. :whitstling:
 
Not ridden any KTM's since about 2013'ish.
I did wonder if I should have gone for one of the latest full fat Superdukes' instead of going down my BottPower route, but I couldn't help myself.
I can't shake off my old school attitude to engine character.....That, and maybe I prefer a challenge.......oh, and then the fact that it isn't as easy to hide on an orange bike. :whitstling:
I had a gen 1 1290 Superduke in original full tango orange. One day I was approaching a roundabout in the distance and noticed by some error 👀(throttle must have stuck of something..) that I was doing substantially in excess of the permitted speed limit 👀, just as a police car pulled out of a gate way just ahead and came towards me. I had no time to trim my speed sufficiently before streaking past like a greased bullet. It was an ordinary patrol car in motion coming towards me, so no chance of a speed check (that situation mayhave changed now - this was ten years ago). But I was the only person for miles around at the time who had one of these bright orange bikes and ever after, that sound body of men, the Dorset constabulary, went out of their way to make a bee line for me to admire it.
 
I had a gen 1 1290 Superduke in original full tango orange. One day I was approaching a roundabout in the distance and noticed by some error 👀(throttle must have stuck of something..) that I was doing substantially in excess of the permitted speed limit 👀, just as a police car pulled out of a gate way just ahead and came towards me. I had no time to trim my speed sufficiently before streaking past like a greased bullet. It was an ordinary patrol car in motion coming towards me, so no chance of a speed check (that situation mayhave changed now - this was ten years ago). But I was the only person for miles around at the time who had one of these bright orange bikes and ever after, that sound body of men, the Dorset constabulary, went out of their way to make a bee line for me to admire it.

I can concur....there are few situations more butt clenching than discovering a stuck throttle just at the entry point to a corner.... :eek:😅

I recall being pulled over early one morning by a motorcycle rozzer when I was using the previous three roundabouts as some entertaining 'S' bends using the racing line while going straight on and I hadn't noticed that he had been 'chasing' me till I had eased back my velocity considerably due to entering a more (potentially) pedestrianised stretch of road.
I was convinced that I was in for trouble but (probably) because he could see I wasn't speeding later on, he just told me to 'next time use my mirrors more' .
I don't know if I was more shocked at being stopped or by being let off.
I felt lucky, that day.
 
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I can concur....there are few situations more butt clenching than discovering a stuck throttle just at the entry point to a corner.... :eek:😅

I recall being pulled over early one morning by a motorcycle rozzer when I was using the previous three roundabouts as some entertaining 'S' bends using the racing line while going straight on and I hadn't noticed that he had been 'chasing' me till I had eased back my velocity considerably due to entering a more (potentially) pedestrianised stretch of road.
I was convinced that I was in for trouble but (probably) because he could see I wasn't speeding later on, he just told me to 'next time use my mirrors more' .
I don't know if I was more shocked at being stopped or by being let off.
I felt lucky, that day.
He was probably a biker himself when out of uniform. He knew you were just having fun on an entertaining stretch when there was no one about and easing up where you had to. He probably does it himself on his days off.
And notice how he had no trouble hanging on to you. It's annoying when you've got a very fast bike and you can't shake off some bloke on an ice-cream van-coloured BMW tourer with handlebar mitts...
 
He was probably a biker himself when out of uniform. He knew you were just having fun on an entertaining stretch when there was no one about and easing up where you had to. He probably does it himself on his days off.
And notice how he had no trouble hanging on to you. It's annoying when you've got a very fast bike and you can't shake off some bloke on an ice-cream van-coloured BMW tourer with handlebar mitts...
Hardly see any these days, compared to back then.
I think they must all be sat in offices stalking granny in case she starts talking about her neighbour on Farcebook........cracking the 'new' crime in the UK.
 
Hardly see any these days, compared to back then.
I think they must all be sat in offices stalking granny in case she starts talking about her neighbour on Farcebook........cracking the 'new' crime in the UK.
You get a few showing up at bike meets round here, often recruiting people for bike-safe riding courses. And that's no bad thing. I'd rather they stopped and took the time to talk to riders about safety and responsible riding instead of hiding in hedges with cameras or surveilling us with drones. One thing about bike cops is most of them are bikers themselves and genuinely care about improving riding standards and reducing accidents rather than just acting as revenue collectors.
They do come out of the woodwork in force when there's a road accident as they can get through the traffic quickest.
 
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