Dyno tune weirdness

vindex1963

Supercharged
Joined
Aug 3, 2019
Messages
443
Location
Payson Arizona
Ride
2006 Rocket 3, 2015 Victory Cross Country
I had the 2006 R3 Classic tuned a while back and it was running very rich in the lower RPM/throttle positions like around 2000-3000 rpm. Example: 70 mph in 5th is 2500 rpm and the bike would run 10.3-10.5:1 air fuel it should cruise around 14:1 air fuel. My mileage went from low to mid 40 mpg to 35 mpg. The back of the bike is covered in black soot.

I installed an Innovate air/fuel gauge and wideband o2 sensor to monitor the bike.

Day of tune in Phoenix AZ was 118 degrees elevation 1086 feet
I live in Payson AZ and the same day 98 degrees elevation 5,003 feet.

I rode down to Phoenix today to have him re-tune the bike and the 93 mile ride took 1/2 of a tank of gas that's hardly 30mpg. The bike was running rich on the ride down.
He put it up on the dyno and everything looks good...WTF.....under 20% throttle was running 14:1 and over 20% throttle was 13.3???? Right where it's supposed to be. He made a few
tweeks to the map but nothing major.

Does the temperature and elevation at the tune shop being different than where I live be that big of a deal? Don't these bikes have sensors that monitor such things?

Being adaptive does running it on the dyno at 1000 feet elevation make it remap the OEM base map while he's tuning then I go to 5000 elevation and it remaps again? Maybe a sensor is
screwed up. I have the new blue TPS set to .63, stepper set to .75 throttle bodies are synced.

The air/fuel mixture coming home to Payson was spot on I'm wondering in a few days if that won't change.

I hope my explanation is clear. What the heck is going on???!!!
 

Ishrub

Retired and loving it!
Joined
Feb 18, 2016
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7,080
Location
Duffy, Canberra, ACT, AUSTRALIA
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R3 Roadster,Sprint ST 1050 ABS, BMW R100RS sidecar
Try this out to see effect of altitude and temperature on air pressure and hence density and Oxygen content available to mix with a fixed fuel map.

Altitude changes like yours would benefit from a PC5 and AT200 auto tune that adjusts the loaded fixed map for those variables.
 

vindex1963

Supercharged
Joined
Aug 3, 2019
Messages
443
Location
Payson Arizona
Ride
2006 Rocket 3, 2015 Victory Cross Country
Try this out to see effect of altitude and temperature on air pressure and hence density and Oxygen content available to mix with a fixed fuel map.

Altitude changes like yours would benefit from a PC5 and AT200 auto tune that adjusts the loaded fixed map for those variables.
Between the Power Commander 5, dyno tune and gas I have an easy $1000 into it, the PC-5 has to stay.
I thought these bikes has the technology to adapt to temp and altitude.
 

Ishrub

Retired and loving it!
Joined
Feb 18, 2016
Messages
7,080
Location
Duffy, Canberra, ACT, AUSTRALIA
Ride
R3 Roadster,Sprint ST 1050 ABS, BMW R100RS sidecar
I am a know-nothing user of of a PC5, AT200 set up, fitted and loaded by HansO himself with a HansO tune for my RamAir, CES and hi-flow rear cans etc at his home on the coast a few years ago. I live at about 2500' inland and I have since fitted the bigger CES version with an OzRider single muffler and did not need to change the tune as it it adjusted for a little extra exhaust flow to achieve the same set AFRs. Well that is my limited understanding anyhow. :unsure: 🤔:)
 

tribal

Turbocharged
Joined
Apr 15, 2006
Messages
788
Location
Fairport, New York USA
Ride
2005 Rocket III & 2015 Rocket III Roadster
No answer for you other than something isn't right and yes it should self-adjust.
I've had my '05 down to sea level and up to 14,000 Ft on Pikes Peak and it always runs great. Below freezing to 115F with no issues.
I run a tune I stole from Hanso and never had it re-dynod. K&N's plus Jardines.
You may want to get TuneECU, disconnect the PC and put on a tune from the Resources section that is closest to your mods and see if it gets better.
I had a PC before TuneBoy and can't recall where to check if you have the O2 sensor enabled/disabled if its physically still there?

FWIW, I get 36-38MPG riding under 80MPH (which is at 3,000RPM on mine).
 
Last edited:

vindex1963

Supercharged
Joined
Aug 3, 2019
Messages
443
Location
Payson Arizona
Ride
2006 Rocket 3, 2015 Victory Cross Country
No answer for you other than something isn't right and yes it should self-adjust.
I've had my '05 down to sea level and up to 14,000 Ft on Pikes Peak and it always runs great. Below freezing to 115F with no issues.
I run a tune I stole from Hanso and never had it re-dynod. K&N's plus Jardines.
You may want to get TuneECU, disconnect the PC and put on a tune from the Resources section that is closest to your mods and see if it gets better.
I had a PC before TuneBoy and can't recall where to check if you have the O2 sensor enabled/disabled if its physically still there?

FWIW, I get 36-38MPG riding under 80MPH (which is at 3,000RPM on mine).
I've been using a tune from the resources it's in my signature. So far the tune is still looking good like the electronics on the bike worked.
I'm attaching a screen shot of my Power Commander tune so you can see how much fuel had to be removed from the base Tune ECU tune.
 

Attachments

warp9.9

Pocałuj mnie w dupę
Joined
Jun 10, 2007
Messages
11,045
Location
Forest City Illinois
Ride
07 Rocket
I had the 2006 R3 Classic tuned a while back and it was running very rich in the lower RPM/throttle positions like around 2000-3000 rpm. Example: 70 mph in 5th is 2500 rpm and the bike would run 10.3-10.5:1 air fuel it should cruise around 14:1 air fuel. My mileage went from low to mid 40 mpg to 35 mpg. The back of the bike is covered in black soot.

I installed an Innovate air/fuel gauge and wideband o2 sensor to monitor the bike.

Day of tune in Phoenix AZ was 118 degrees elevation 1086 feet
I live in Payson AZ and the same day 98 degrees elevation 5,003 feet.

I rode down to Phoenix today to have him re-tune the bike and the 93 mile ride took 1/2 of a tank of gas that's hardly 30mpg. The bike was running rich on the ride down.
He put it up on the dyno and everything looks good...WTF.....under 20% throttle was running 14:1 and over 20% throttle was 13.3???? Right where it's supposed to be. He made a few
tweeks to the map but nothing major.

Does the temperature and elevation at the tune shop being different than where I live be that big of a deal? Don't these bikes have sensors that monitor such things?

Being adaptive does running it on the dyno at 1000 feet elevation make it remap the OEM base map while he's tuning then I go to 5000 elevation and it remaps again? Maybe a sensor is
screwed up. I have the new blue TPS set to .63, stepper set to .75 throttle bodies are synced.

The air/fuel mixture coming home to Payson was spot on I'm wondering in a few days if that won't change.

I hope my explanation is clear. What the heck is going on???!!!
Couple quick questions,
What are you running the taller 240/55/16 tire? What is the speedo calibration correction set at in the tune? And your Air fuel meter does it record air fuel ratio verses rpm and throttle position? I've only ran the Wego III wide band A/F metering, which is why I'm asking. But first you rpm verses speed is off and if thats true your odometer can be off also. Oh and are you using a gps to monitor actual speed and mileage?
 

Kevin frazier

Widowmaker!
Joined
Dec 22, 2018
Messages
3,736
Location
Nashville
Ride
2008 Triumph rocket 3 touring
How long ago were you here?
i left holbrook and road strait down the pony express trail to the mountain turned right went through there and into payson and onto 17 theyre were fires and road was shut down, dropped off into Phoenix, started to cook and thank God i made it to peoria before my helmet melted. It was challenging but my bike loves the mountains, it really comes alive, my tuner was very surprised as he was worried about elevation and detonation
 

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